What is progressive rock??

[transatlantic]

This music station called Aural-Moon progressive music. Some music i listen on this station isn't progressive rock music. I think you can't call this station progressive

Progressive music: Pink floyd, Yes, Rush ,Dream Theater, IQ, Caravan, Flower Kings, Spock'Beard, Marillion, ELP,transatlantic and genesis.

This music is progressive. It sounds hard, instrumental, solo, and it isn't soft or boring.

That's my meaning about progressive rock

[Rick and Roll]

But I will put in my 2 cents. First of all, your bio says you were born in 1997. You are precocious:)

My base music is what you like. Rush Tull etc. However, I also like fusion, funk, art, all kinds of things. Rush is on the Moon - I don't think that's progressive, ok? But I don't mind at all.

The only thing I will say is please do not worry about the label. That's all it is. The station needs to call it something. Would you rather have a cumbersome name that is unrepresentative?

This is a pointless discussion, unless you have an alternative. Please have an alternative - never say "you can't call it this" - no -you tell us what you would like it called. I can't stress that enough. If you complain, come up with something better!

There's been other threads about this. Please read those, too.

[Rick and Roll]

Originally posted by transatlantic

Progressive music: Pink floyd, Yes, Rush ,Dream Theater, IQ, Caravan, Flower Kings, Spock'Beard, Marillion, ELP,transatlantic and genesis.

This music is progressive. It sounds hard, instrumental, solo, and it isn't soft or boring.

That's my meaning about progressive rock



Sorry one more.

Rush, transatlantic Dream Theater. Not very progressive.

[transatlantic]

sorry but you don't under stand my meaning of this thread. I want to know what is your meaning about progressive music.

If you like fusion. Why doi i hear fusion on an station that called progressive rock.

Call the station only aural moon or aural moon the station for the music that you like.

So conclusion: I want youtr opinion about the word progrssive rock.

I'am born in 1979

[Wojtek]

Originally posted by transatlantic

Progressive music: Flower Kings, Spock'Beard, transatlantic

These three bands 'progressive'? 100% regressive!
It's not a malice, I only want to show you that term 'prog rock' is very imprecise. It can have different meanings:
- strictly literal, but then we can tell that only 70's bands like Yes or Genesis were really progressive as nowadays lions share of bands refer to the 70's, so they don't play progressive music
- conventional, but here the problem is that nobody knows where are the borders between rock and prog. These rules cannot be specified, because take for example Transatlantic's We All need Some Light. Is it prog? Yes and no.
- popular, nowadays there is tendence to treat progressive music as a 'platform' between 'ordinary radio rock' and avangarde. Quite good solution but here also we have a problem of undefined characteristics.

To sum up, music terminology is Augias stable. So don't be suprised about AM playlist.

[transatlantic]

you can't compare the music of '70 with the music that bands are making today: like spock's beard. I think the music is more agressive than than the '70 . '70 was more sympho music. more soft music. The progrock music in 2004 is harder rock musicc, a lot of instruments

Greetings transatlantic

[Rick and Roll]

I am a big hard rock (don't call it metal) fan - Sabbath, Maiden, Priest. That music had edge.

The music you speak of like OSI, etc are not really technically prog! The boundaries are just stretched.

If you got past the few bands you mentioned, you'd get a lot of heavy 70's & 80's prog. Try a few - request some.

My fellow Monnies, make some artist suggestions for our Holland friend!

[Lady Roxelle]

Transatlantic my friend:

Permit me introduce yourself: I´m son of 70´s too, I grew in the 80´s hard rock ( and why not ) heavy gardens, so I discovered the progressive rock music in the early 90´s. For me it was a big discovery.
Accourding the definitions, progressive music can be all long duration musics, that sound as concept musics; various climate situations inside the same song; complexity in arrangement and in musicians performance; triping lyrics.

I think that under this definition, Dream Theater is prog as Rush. In my point of view, although I don´t like Dream Theater music.
So to close my reply, try this link: Is very elucidative, and it will help you to understand the Progressive Rock sub-genres, and space, art, fusion, symphonic, rock.

http://www.avila.med.br/closeto/arvore.html

Truly yours,
Vanila

[progdirjim]

I don't have time right now to compose a well thought out reply. But, we at Aural Moon tend to use a looser definition of progressive rather than a tighter definition. That's not going to change.

[Yesspaz]

Blimey, are we having this discussion again? Transatlantic dude, it says you've been a memeber of the Moon since... This month. Somebody's got to be mean, so it might as well be me. Don't show up somewhere and on your first day start criticizing it with your narrow definition and try to sound authoritative. The official workers at this station (Avian and ProgDirJim) and to a lesser extent the lesserlings (Roger.Lee, theoriginal_ib, ExtendedPlay, myself...) have worked hard to make this station the number one progressive rock station on the net. AM's been around since 1999 (or earlier) and has a huge library. If you'd care to do a little research, such authorities as AllMusic.com and The Gibraltar Encyclopedia of Progressive Rock lists literally dozens of subgenres. So until you are well versed in Kraut (Neu!, Kraftwerk), Neo-Kraut (To Rococo Rot), Canterbury (Gentle Giant, Soft Machine), Modern Experimental (Godspeed You Black Emperor!, Blue Man Group), Pop-Prog (Journey, Styx), Post-Rock (Mogwai, Tortoise, Billy Mahonie, The Letter E), and dozens of other prog-subgenres - I repeat - until you are well-versed in all of this, don't come to an established station patroned by literally hundreds of prog-lovers and tell us what is and is not progressive rock.

As for fusion, go to a research site like All Music Guide (http://www.allmusic.com/) and search for Mahavishu Orchestra or Return to Forever and look at "related styles." Guess what you'll see? "Prog Rock/Art Rock."

In other words, if you are interested in your definition of prog only, and you don't think AM is that station, don't listen. Go elsewhere.

I'm gonna request some Journey for you now.






"Related Styles: Industrial Psychedelic Goth Rock Glam Rock Euro-Rock Kraut Rock Acid Rock Arena Rock British Metal Jazz-Rock Neo-Psychedelia Space Rock Guitar Virtuoso Progressive Metal Neo-Prog Experimental Rock Neo-Classical Metal Album Rock Canterbury Scene Obscuro Symphonic Black Metal Avant-Prog"

[Wojtek]

Sorry to say that but IMO you misssed the point of transatlantic doubts Yesspaz. It wan not a frontal attack on Aural Moon.

[Roger -Dot- Lee]

Yesspaz Sez:

Somebody's got to be mean, so it might as well be me.

You're being a lot more gentle than I'd have been, had I felt like posting the first time I saw this screed.

I'm going to make a confession here, simply because there's a story that goes along with it that's very much akin to the situation here.

Y'see, I don't drink alcohol. I quit drinking in 1992 because, quite frankly, I was drinking myself into an early grave. I found "salvation" (read "holding on with both hands and white knuckles) in AA. I bounced in, hitting both sides of the doorjam. One of the traditions is that we take our program on the road. I was doing this, in a jail somewhere (y'all don't need to know where).

This is where it gets similar.

There was this inmate who was in for his third conviction of drunk driving. He was at a meeting, and he piped up, saying that "You know, I'd probably go there if ..." and proceeded to list a few things that he thought would make the program work for him.

Our response: "We'll take it under advisement."

I doubt he got the irony implicit.

So Transatlantic, I'd like to state personally:

"We'll take it under advisement."

El Queso Grande (ProgDirJim) sez:

I don't have time right now to compose a well thought out reply. But, we at Aural Moon tend to use a looser definition of progressive rather than a tighter definition. That's not going to change.


To which I respond:

PAH-RAAAAIIIISE BE! </SouthernBabtisPreacher>

Trans: Take 'spaz's advice to heart. We're successful here. And I'm sure we'll all be truly disappointed if you decide we're not 'prog' enough for you. No, Really!

Roger "Lesserling? Cool! I've been promoted!" -dot- Lee

[Rick and Roll]

Originally posted by Yesspaz
this station the number one progressive rock station on the net.

To quote Charlie Brown, "has everyone gone commercial"?

:D :D :D

[Yesspaz]

Rick, love your levity!

And thanks for backing me up, Roger.Lee.

[Yesspaz]

Originally posted by Wojtek
Sorry to say that but IMO you misssed the point of transatlantic doubts Yesspaz. It wan not a frontal attack on Aural Moon.

Au Contraire Woj....

Originally posted by transatlantic
This music station called Aural-Moon progressive music. Some music i listen on this station isn't progressive rock music. I think you can't call this station progressive

and

Originally posted by transatlantic
[Pink floyd, Yes, Rush ,Dream Theater, IQ, Caravan, Flower Kings, Spock'Beard, Marillion, ELP,transatlantic and genesis] is progressive.... and it isn't soft or boring.



If that's not an attack by our newest member, I don't know what is. Look at the top of the first page of the forums. transatlantic is our newest member, and then he says that the station's not progressive. If that's the way he feels, why join and listen?

I've got no patience for that kind of nonsense...

[Michael]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll


My fellow Monnies, make some artist suggestions for our Holland friend!
Here goes!!!
Frank Mariano's Mahogany Rush
Armageddon
Bloodrock passage
Ahh and my Avatar Good old Captain Beyond
All Bands from the 70's that Rocked but most people never heard of em!!!!

[KeithieW]

Here we go again!!!!!!!!!!!

Transatlantic, when you've been around here for a while, and I sincerely hope you do stay around, you will know that Yesspaz and I have the odd disagreement (all friendly) about a few things. However, I am in total agreement with Spaz here.

Aural Moon has a list of over 11,000 tracks all of which have been given the "OK" by Avian and prodirjim to be added to the playlist. True, there are some tracks that aren't progressive (Mozert and Beethoven for example) but I don't know of one radio station that sticks to it's remit 100%. Here in the UK we have "Classic FM" which throws in the odd Jazz or Rock track from time to time, for example.

With a playlist this size, if you can't find something that interests you and makes you want to click the request button then, maybe, you should, broaden your horizons. There is a wealth of music out there on the Moon that will delight you.

The people here on Aural Moon are one of the most passionate groups I have ever come accross in my 48 years on Earth and, like all families, we have our disagreements but the underlieing feeling is one of harmony and love nurtured by a passion for decent music.

Come and join the family transatlantic, I know you'll feel good.

By the way, if I have missed the point and you really do just want a definition of what we feel is prog, click this link and it will take you to some threads where this has been thrashed to death.

http://auralmoon.com/forum/search.php?s=&action=showresults&searchid=8432&sortby=lastpost&sortorder=descending

[Wojtek]

Originally posted by Yesspaz


I've got no patience for that kind of nonsense...

Yesspaz, to begin with, of course I also see more nonsense than sense in it. But I think that these words result rather from superficial progressive rock knowledge than offensive attitude towards Aural Moon. I used to try to explain gently if I see (and here it is definitely seen) that a person is a prog rock layman. I think it is better solution to solve such problems in such way than 'welcoming' our new member with 'go elsewhere'. We can limit the answer to one sentence. As progressive rock bands have also straightforward rock songs on their albums, but because of the prog rock compositions advantage are called prog rock bands, Aural Moon doesn't have to have only 100% progressive songs, especially as there are some non-prog bands worth hearing.
Peace.

[Yesspaz]

suggestions for transatlantic:

Sigur Ros
American Football
Adiemus
Iona
Don Caballero
Gentle Giant
Mike Oldfield
any Journey song that is on the Moon
Kansas
Godspeed You Black Emperor!
King Black Acid
Billy Mahonie
Tarentel
Neal Schon
PFM
Gong
Can
Faust
Neu!

and since you like Deram Theater/Transatlantic style...

Platypus
Liquid Tension Experiment
The Jelly Jam

[transatlantic]

hi alle aural moon fans

First i want apologize for my reaction as a new member. But when i see the forum i get a lot of reactions.

I still be a listener to this great radio, because there are less places where you can find progressive music.
The interest for this musci start 4 years a go. When i listen to music like dream theater, rush, transatlantic,IQ, spock's beard and flower king.
But now i want to go farther in this music, because there is much more music than those groups in the genre progressive music. I can say: progressive music you can define in different ways

Transatlantic

[Roger -Dot- Lee]

Originally posted by transatlantic
First i want apologize for my reaction as a new member. But when i see the forum i get a lot of reactions.


that you did. It's generally considered rude to dive into a forum that you haven't been involved with in an argumentative manner.

Unless, of course, you're on Usenet. Then it's expected. Especially in alt.flame


I still be a listener to this great radio, because there are less places where you can find progressive music.
The interest for this musci start 4 years a go. When i listen to music like dream theater, rush, transatlantic,IQ, spock's beard and flower king.


A good start, but definitely not what I would consider a wide representation of that what we call 'Progressive'.


But now i want to go farther in this music, because there is much more music than those groups in the genre progressive music.


An admirable goal. But one doesn't learn much by immediately criticizing the playlist after listening for a couple of days/weeks. We have thousands upon thousands of songs (well over 11,000 and growing on a weekly, sometimes daily basis). All hand picked by Avian and Program Director Jim.

If you don't like what you're hearing at the moment, stick around. It'll change. And request something you'll like.

(only try to avoid Godspeed You! Black Emporer, please. :P )


I can say: progressive music you can define in different ways

Correct. And it goes quite a ways beyond Yes, Rush, Pink Floyd, and The Moody Blues. Stick around. Ya might learn something.

Roger -dot- Lee

[transatlantic]

Hi lee

i want to thank you for your respond. When i read all the reactions i can only say: Every day is a day that you can learn and discover more proressive music.

Transatlantic

[Rick and Roll]

Originally posted by Yesspaz
The official workers at this station (Avian and ProgDirJim) and to a lesser extent the lesserlings (Roger.Lee, theoriginal_ib, ExtendedPlay, myself...)

Did you get promoted?

[Rick and Roll]

Originally posted by Yesspaz

and since you like Deram Theater/Transatlantic style...


The Jelly Jam

Jelly Jam style like those? Huh?

[Yesspaz]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll


Did you get promoted?


Yes... BrainRock is coming.

[Yesspaz]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll


Jelly Jam style like those? Huh?
not exactly, but it's the same revolving troup of ten players or so.

[Rick and Roll]

the drummer, he was in the dregs and god forbid - Winger!

only Myung is the same.

oh btw Wojtek - thank you for your insightful posts in this thread. thay are very well thought out.

[Roger -Dot- Lee]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
the drummer, he was in the dregs [...]

You make it sound like an accusation! :P

oh btw Wojtek - thank you for your insightful posts in this thread. thay are very well thought out.

Say on Brother Rick.

Personally, I think I'm just going to take a step back from these inflammatory threads for a few days. It almost seems like we're starting to wage war on one another.

I get enough of that crap from my ex-wife and my brother's ex-wife. I don't need it on my off hours, too.

[Yesspaz]

Hey transatlantic. Sorry about coming down so hard on you right off the bat. I think maybe I was having a crappy day and that was the last straw. Anyway, I'm glad you'll be sticking around. All those bands you mentioned in your posts are legitimate choices for good bands. By listening to AM, I'm sure you'll meet many many more. Ask Keith Waye. He's bought over 60 cds in the past twelve months from stuff he's heard on AM. That's over one a week. Wow.

[Lady Roxelle]

hello Transatlantic!

I can also recommend you some very good bands and it´s albuns:

Eloy - Ocean; Power and the Passion; Ocean2; Dawn; Colours
Novalis - (German lyrics) - Sommerabend; Brandung
Ramses - La Leyla ; Eternity Rise
PLJ Band - Armaggedon
Tisaris - Once Humanity
Grobschnitt - Grobschnitt; Ballermann; Jumbo; Rockpommel´s Land; The History of Solar Music Vol. 1,2,3 and 4
Errata Corrige - Siegfried, Il Drago e altre story
Tiamat - Wild Honey
Par Lindh Project - Gothic Impressions; Bilbo (with Bjorn Johansson); Baroque Impression; Veni, Vidi, Vinci
Bo Hansson - Lord of the Rings (Sagan om Ringen); Magician Hat
Jane - All 70´s albuns; Ressurection

Well I ´ve forgot some band...Yesspaz have included in its reply some of them.
So try it these bands, you´ll not br regret!

Hugs,

Vanila

[transatlantic]

Hi

Thanks for the bands you named. I will heard if those bands are good for me.

The band Trnasatlantic has many epics (long play numbers) Anybody know bands who also play epics???
I like epics because most of the songs are very good. The songs are divided into separate parts. Each parts has his own story and music. When you put all the story's to one pease than it is a great song to listen

See for your self pink floyd, genesis, yes, dream theater (Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence cd 2) and flower kings etc

Transatlantic

[Rick and Roll]

check out "Unfolded Like Staircase". Four tunes, each 12-20 minutes.

[Yesspaz]

If you like experimental stuff, Godspeed You Black Emperor! does some long stuff, in the 15 to 30 minute range.

Focus has some long stuff.

Mogwai has an EP that's a 20 minute instrumetal called "My Father My King"

King Black Acid is a good try for "mind-altering neo-psych jams" as one reviewer put it. Heck, their fourth album is even called "King Black Acid Loves a Long Song."

And Tarentel is quite good at the extended neo-Kraut type stuff.

Speaking of which, try Autobahn by Kraftwerk.

Finally, never overlook Mike Oldfield. I've noticed that you name a lot of very famous proggers. Surprised Oldfield is not one of them. Go to the requests and try out Tubular Bells, Tubular Bells III, Ommadawn, Incantations, Hergest Ridge, the Taurus cycle, Amarok, The Wind Chimes, and The Lake (There are others, Tubular Bells II is on AM in a chopped up form. There is also The Songs of Distant Earth, but it's not on AM).

In short, LOTS of long prog songs on AM. Everything listed above is on AM for you to sample, with the exception if the Mogwai. Enjoy.

[dbolli]

Hi All,

In the liner notes to the King Crimson 1998 live album Absent Lovers, Robert Fripp says: "Professor Bill Martin (in his Listening to the Future) puts the period of 'progressive' as 1968 -1978". Fripp also makes reference to the "quintessentially English nature of 'progressive'".

Obviously those narrow parameters would severely limit a station like Aural Moon, so there needs to be a broader approach to include music from all over the world, both new and older that embraces the spirit of "progressive".

For me, the conceptual depth and high quality of the musical and lyrical content and the high level of musical training and ability is what signifies "progressive".

Cheers,

[Wojtek]

Originally posted by Yesspaz
Go to the requests and try out (...) Amarok,

PLEASE DON'T! :eek:

[KeithieW]

Originally posted by Wojtek


PLEASE DON'T! :eek:

LMAO Woj.............I thought that was your favourite Oldfield album. At least, you always threaten to play it for me when I get into a Tales from Topographic Oceans mood.:D

[transatlantic]

Hi

I have taken the advice of you people and i download the cd of the band Eloy. The cd Ocean 2. Whow this album is very. I wished i have heard of this band some 10 years ago.

Anyone more ideas for epics

Guys you gave me the advice listen to king crimson. Conclusion: This is not my band. This music is to old for me.

Transatantic

[Rick and Roll]

I thought they were old too!:cool:

I mentioned Discipline a few posts back.......check it out you'll like them.

[prythm]

Transatlantic, be careful about 'downloading' music. What is great about the music on this site is that it is not commercial, meaning that the musicians sacrificed money and fame in order to concentrate on the art or music. Most of these musicians are more talented than commercial artists, and more true to their craft. This generates music that is relevent, inovative, and music that truely 'progresses'(keeping with the thread theme) into unexplored sonic territory. Most of these great artists don't get the respect they deserve and unfortunately don't get paid for their talent, yet commercial musicians make fortunes. My point-- download music to discover new sounds, which I am guilty of, but remember to help support them by actually purchasing an album once in awhile. This is not a flame, just a general reminder, for myself as well. I still have to sign up for that higher bandwidth Aural Moon account;) !

[QuantumJo]

Why assume that it was not paid for?

[Yesspaz]

Originally posted by QuantumJo
Why assume that it was not paid for?

iTunes rules, but I hate that to get it to a normal mp3 file I have to burn it to cd, then turn around and rip it to mp3.

That's Apple software for ya... :rolleyes:

[prythm]

- Why assume that it was not paid for?


QuantumJo, you're correct. My apologies to TransA. My intention was really not to reprimand. Just thought it was a good subject to bring up. I am very sensitive about and possible sickened by the commercial music industry, as well as any commercial industry, and its influence on the creation of art of all medium. It’s a bit of a sensitive issue with me and I like to vent to other people who might understand.

Good music, good art, just doesn’t get the respect it deserves. People who stay true to creating art for arts sake rarely succeed and usually suffer a life of financial mediocrity. While ‘actors’ such as those on Thursday night sitcoms make 1 million dollars for 10 minutes(that’s $100,000 dollars per minute) of reciting horrible dialogue (not exactly on subject but just needed to vent). This might be more prevalent in America but in most cases to make money you have to ‘sell-out’. It’s tough to support the ‘progress of music’ in this case. It’s tough to find audiences who sponsor musical exploration endeavors and those committed to the cause. It comes partially down to the lack of education of the arts, which America doesn’t really understand the importance of.

Mentioned earlier in the thread was a Dregs drummer who was in Winger for a bit. He met up with my friend once and actually apologized – “sorry bout that Winger thing”. So goes the story. I’ll bet that’s where the money was, even if it meant playing your drums into a sequencer and replacing the drum track with triggered sampled drums.

This web site understands the importance of art music and provides a wonderful meeting people for people who also understand- dedicated to the cause. In my thoughts the site should be government grant sponsored for supporting the arts. Bush would probably support Godspeed ;)

Sorry for the rant and I appreciate your time. The subject does hit close to home but I am seeking professional help. I promise.

[Rick and Roll]

Originally posted by prythm
-ce of.

Mentioned earlier in the thread was a Dregs drummer who was in Winger for a bit. He met up with my friend once and actually apologized – “sorry bout that Winger thing”.

Nice rant, I liked it!

I wonder why Rod M. apologized. Hell, Chris Slade was with AC/DC for a while. I don't mind that stuff, it's not my place to tell someone who to play with.

[Yesspaz]

Originally posted by prythm
Bush would probably support Godspeed ;)

Well, they're Canadian, so that would be a bit weird, but maybe he'd support King Black Acid?:D

[zvinki]

Well, they're Canadian, so that would be a bit weird

You said it spaz! Bush supporting something Canadian!?! Crazy!!

[KeithieW]

Originally posted by zvinki


You said it spaz! Bush supporting something Canadian!?! Crazy!!

Well he is mad enough to support Godpeed!!! :D

[progdirjim]

Bush supporting anything rational? Preposterous!

oops, did I say that out loud?:D ;)

[Lewis]

I have been a prog. fan since the mid seventies, and I have seen this word progressive thrown around alot, progressive jazz, synth, prog. rock. To me progressive rock is music that lends itself to no rules, unlike many of the bands of the 70's and 80's which followed musical formulas, progressive bands make it up as they went along. So it is really the integrity of the music written and played that makes progressive rock what it is.
Be it fusion, classical, rock, jazz....:)

[transatlantic]

hi
I agreed with you. the word progessive is something mysterious and anyone on this planet has his own opinion about this subject.

I have a discuss subject.

Neal morse has make an new cd: TESTIMONY. When you read the magazines and look on the internet this cd is the best album of the year.

The most people like this album because the instruments are good, but when you listen what neal has to say than you hear jezus and god.

Are songs about jesus and god progressive or gospel music?

Transatlantic

[Wojtek]

Originally posted by transatlantic
hi
I agreed with you. the word progessive is something mysterious and anyone on this planet has his own opinion about this subject.

I have a discuss subject.

Neal morse has make an new cd: TESTIMONY. When you read the magazines and look on the internet this cd is the best album of the year.

The most people like this album because the instruments are good, but when you listen what neal has to say than you hear jezus and god.

Are songs about jesus and god progressive or gospel music?

Transatlantic

Hmm.... I don't know many but I can recommend Spock's Beard-Snow (allegedly not an album about it, but it has alegorical sense, is a document of Morse conversion, and of course Wind At My Back is a prayer).
Try also Iona, the hidden pearl of progressive rock. I can't understand - how can they be so unpopular even among progfans.

[transatlantic]

IS THE ALBUM THESTIMONY OF NEAL MORSE PROGRESSIVE MUSIC OR GOSPEL????


regards Transatlantic

[KeithieW]

Originally posted by transatlantic
hi
Are songs about jesus and god progressive or gospel music?

Transatlantic

The subject shouldn't matter at all. It's the style that the song is performed in that makes it prog.

Neal Morse found God and writes about that but in a prog way.

If the Edwin Hawkins Singers did one of his songs it would be Gospel.

Flame on!!!!:D

[QuantumJo]

I fail to see the importance of having the music that we listen to, to be so well defined. Is it this? Is it that? Does it really matter? For myself, what I consider to be great music is sonic pleasure that evokes a favorable emotional reaction. Let’s not be overwhelmed by trying to categorize then subcategorize what we hear. Enjoy it for what it is - The Art Of Music.

[zvinki]

I agree with Keithie, the subject does not matter. As a matter of fact, many prog songs are spiritual in nature exploring the who's and why's of our existence. Have you listened to Testimony? You can't tell me that "A whole Nother Trip" is not prog.

[Rick and Roll]

of Wojtek's "Stardust We Are" (Faffers We Are") bastardization. Brilliant!

Content of lyrics does not make prog. I for one, prefer music not written about fairies and fantasy.

[Wojtek]

So, if I missed the point, my anwer is: God is one of the many topics progbands sing about and this fact doesn't change prog into gospel.

[Wojtek]

Guys, you mentioned importance of lyrics in prog. For me subject does matter, although it is not all. I can hear music and even not try to understand what it is about, but the fact is that good concept, unforgettable significance in prog is a spiced-up pork, lady with make-up, wall with paintings....

[Rick and Roll]

Originally posted by Wojtek
unforgettable significance in prog is a spiced-up pork, lady with make-up....

You scare me woj......

A spiced-up pork lady with make-up. Sounds like an old blind date of mine!

[Roger -Dot- Lee]

The short answer, as far as I'm concerned, is "Who cares?" I judge a song or a band by the contents of its music, not simply the lyrics. Hell, half the time I don't understand what they're saying. Doesn't matter. If it's good music, and the lyrics fit, it's good. If it isn't, it isn't (profound, huh?).

[Wojtek]

And it made me hungry.
My other needs have been satisfied while visiting baker's daughters today :D

[zvinki]

Of course subject matters in terms of your enjoyment of a song but the subject does not define its genre.

prog is a spiced-up pork, lady with make-up, wall with paintings

Is this in honour of Poet's Day?

A spiced-up pork lady with make-up. Sounds like an old blind date of mine!

Was this in Montreal? I think we may have dated the same girl Rick!

[Rick and Roll]

><Barry-Manilow-Luvers-owner@yahoogroups.com>

a friend of mine sent me this. Haven't looked at it yet.....

This has as much to do with the discussion as anything else
:)

[KeithieW]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
><Barry-Manilow-Luvers-owner@yahoogroups.com>

:)

Many (low) thanks for that Ricardo.

I'll take a look at that later. You never know, there might be some middle aged housewife waiting to hear from me :D :p

[Yesspaz]

Originally posted by transatlantic
IS THE ALBUM THESTIMONY OF NEAL MORSE PROGRESSIVE MUSIC OR GOSPEL????


The answer: Both.

Gospel is not a genre of style as much as a genre of content. Neal Morse converted to Christianity very publicly. He's a progster. He's gonna write prog songs that convey his Christianity. It's "gospel Prog Rock," if you will. I am an evangelical Protestant (seminary student no less) and a prog fan. There are hundreds of great rock bands made of Christians doing "Christian" music out there, contrary to the stereotype of them being hacks. But there aren't very many of a progressive nature. Neal Morse, Kerry Livgren, Iona, Jeremy, etc., in my opinion, are an example of what I'd like to see more of (I'm sure non-Christians might have a variety of opinions here).

In sum, "prog" and "gospel" are not mutually exclusive terms. Rush is prog, not gospel. Third Day are gospel, not prog (Southern Rock). Neal Morse is both gospel and prog.

[progdirjim]

Originally posted by Yesspaz


The answer: Both.

Gospel is not a genre of style as much as a genre of content. Neal Morse converted to Christianity very publicly. He's a progster. He's gonna write prog songs that convey his Christianity. It's "gospel Prog Rock," if you will. I am an evangelical Protestant (seminary student no less) and a prog fan. There are hundreds of great rock bands made of Christians doing "Christian" music out there, contrary to the stereotype of them being hacks. But there aren't very many of a progressive nature. Neal Morse, Kerry Livgren, Iona, Jeremy, etc., in my opinion, are an example of what I'd like to see more of (I'm sure non-Christians might have a variety of opinions here).

In sum, "prog" and "gospel" are not mutually exclusive terms. Rush is prog, not gospel. Third Day are gospel, not prog (Southern Rock). Neal Morse is both gospel and prog.

Good answer Spaz. Me, I base my opinion of music on both the music and the lyrical content. As a devout agnostic, I don't mind Christian lyrics as long as there's some depth to them. "Praise Jesus" repeated 700 times is just as bad as "boogie mama" repeated 700 times (to use a facetious example). Jeremy is instrumental and quite good, I think. Neal Morse seems to be drifitng towards weaker music, though "Snow" is one of SB's best, IMO. Judge each effort individually and don't worry about labels, is my ultimate point here...

[Rick and Roll]

Originally posted by progdirjim


As a devout agnostic

To me devout implies religion. You can be a non-practicing (fill in the blank with your religion), or just an agnostic.

Sounds like a Near (beer) Fest discussion to me.;)

[Yesspaz]

Originally posted by progdirjim
"Praise Jesus" repeated 700 times is just as bad as "boogie mama" repeated 700 times (to use a facetious example).

Well said...

[moses]

Originally posted by progdirjim

Neal Morse seems to be drifitng towards weaker music...

Well here I'm gonna politely disagree. I've got Testimony in the car right now and it sure seems powerful to me. Musically it might be "lighter" than some of the stuff he did with Spock's Beard in that there's less distorted guitar, but I think these are some of the best-put-together songs he's done.

Granted, the lyrics connect with me personally (being also in that Evangelical Protestant ilk with Yesspaz) and I might be weighing them a bit higher on that basis, but isn't that the way all music is? It reaches different people differently.

[QuantumJo]

http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Progressive_rock

[Rick and Roll]

Mistakes aplenty!

Garden of Dreams by FK is not an epic. It is many pieces stuck together.

Echoes is not an epic. It's a jam/space back and forth.

Tales I would argue is not a true "concept album". It's four pieces of music by each member. Sort of like Fragile, on steroids.

Syncopation is not particular to prog. Ooooh syncopation!!! Every song has syncopation, even "Row Row Your Freaking Boat".

Madness as a common theme? Try the grunge or metal for that.

Like the overuse of Dream Theater. Thought they weren't prog.

I always thought Rush and Devo used the same meter in many tunes (Rush was cited as an example, Devo is not).

Close to the edge is NOT a four-part song. It has an intro into a theme, and ok another part, but returns to the theme. That's two parts, if you're scoring at home.

Godspeed is said to include "the aesthetic sensibilities" of punk rock. I need several thousand beers to figure that one out!

I like the last line about Tool. They don't know what to classify it as! Love it!

Two of my favorite bands are defined as progressive - King's X and XTC. Let's get 'em on the playlist, then!

:D :D

Even the Galactic Cowboys are in there! (only cause they toured with king's x, no doubt). Too bad the Butthole Surfers didn't tour with them too, they'd be in there.

I get such a kick out of this pigeon-holing.

[Roger -Dot- Lee]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
Mistakes aplenty!

Syncopation is not particular to prog. Ooooh syncopation!!! Every song has syncopation, even "Row Row Your Freaking Boat".


Not necessarily.

I know of TWO John Philip Sousa songs that have no syncopation whatsoever. None.

[Rick and Roll]

remind me not to use words like NEVER and ALWAYS and NONE and ALL and EVERY.

:D

[Roger -Dot- Lee]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
remind me not to use words like NEVER and ALWAYS and NONE and ALL and EVERY.

:D

Indeed...especially when correcting someone else's mistakes. It's along the lines of spelling or grammar flames. You will invariably have at least one spelling or grammar error in your post. Guaranteed.

Happens to me all the time.

Roger -Dot- Lee, who should be in bed by now.

[KeithieW]

Any statement you make that could be misread, misconstrued and cause someone to be upset or, more importantly, sue, could have ALLEGADLY tagged on the end of it to tone it down.

eg.

KeithieW is a drunken sot who knows nothing about nothing, ALLEGADLY.

GY!BE make music, ALLEGADLY............:D

CYA = Cover Your Arse (ALLEGADLY)

[Rick and Roll]

Alledgedly is spelled wrong.

Roger, I proofread my posts. I try not to use words I can't spell (which is a lot). It is guaranteed that if I make a spelling error, it is intentional.

Now I may make punctuation errors, but so does GYBE.

[kirk]

"Garden of Dreams by FK is not an epic. It is many pieces stuck together".

hey rick- you could say the same for "close to the edge",
"and you and I"..many early yes tunes.

porcupine tree (fr'instance) fuses dissimilar parts
using efx as bridges. it's a trademark of prog,
(sort of) an extension of the R&R " middle ten"-
(.."life is very short, and there's no ti-i-i-i-ime....").

now, everyone play nice. if i have to stop this car...
:D

p e a c e kirk

[KeithieW]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
Alledgedly is spelled wrong.

Roger, I proofread my posts. I try not to use words I can't spell (which is a lot). It is guaranteed that if I make a spelling error, it is intentional.

Now I may make punctuation errors, but so does GYBE.

You're right Rick, allegedly was spelt wrong. :D

So that's either one of those US/UK spelling differences (possible) or the spelling error was intentional (more likely as I know you always tell the truth).

[kirk]

haha no keith, there's but 1 "d" in "allegedly"
on either side of the pond.

zenpool's guitarist steve hall is a senior lecturer
at northumbria in newcastle.
it took a bit of adjustment at first,
since he speaks english and i don't:D

even my london friends can't understand the geordies.

[Roger -Dot- Lee]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
Alledgedly is spelled wrong.

Roger, I proofread my posts. I try not to use words I can't spell (which is a lot). It is guaranteed that if I make a spelling error, it is intentional.

Now I may make punctuation errors, but so does GYBE.
I realize that, and I wasn't accusing you of making any spelling errors. I don't do spelling flames, since I invariably get tripped up by them. I was simply drawing a parallel with a well known Usenet Phenomenon. That's all.

Roger "INCOMING" -Dot- Lee