Musicians or non musicians

[Andyyyy]

Hi All,
I'm not new to AM, but I am new to the forum, and I like what I see here! I don't do too many forums, just not enough time in the day to do that and to listen to or play music. Since prog is such a different type of music from others (except maybe jazz and classical) in that it's more complex, I wonder if the percentage of musicians here is higher than say, on a country site, or hip hop, or fill in the ____________________.

I guess I'll start off saying that I am a musician, though I started later in life, so I am not as good now as I could have been if I did continue those piano lessons in 4th grade.

Also, what other types of music do prog fans listen to. I tend to like only prog, jazz, or classical.

:rockband:

Andy

[Rick and Roll]

I am a non-musician. I played Baritone in school, only because everyone was steered away from Trumpet.:hrm:

I'd guess you'd find more musicians than not here, but probably not more than other forums.

However, I do have some interesting and annoying attributes, none of which pays the bills:

I can recognize a song in very few notes. I can recite complete song orders from a lot of records. I know a lot of times of songs.:aua:

As for other genres, I love hard rock and power pop, if they're done without sounding forced. Bands like the Smithereens, Dada..that I can do. A lot of "Neo"...nah. Same with hard rock (I despise the term heavy metal). I like Maiden, Priest. Not so with a lot of prog-metal.

I grew up with funk too, and still like R & B.

But not straight rap or most country.

[RogorMortis]

I'll join in as a non musician.
I am musical but never lived in one place long enough where I could have enough lessons on the piano and when we moved from UK to DK back in 1969 I had no instrument and my parents couldn't afford any. So my musical knowledge ended there, so i just dabble on a keyboard once in a while. Shame really, I regret it awfully now I didn't push to learn something except the recorder as music in schools in DK is not as well organised as in UK.
Oh I did sing a bit in choirs until my voice broke in two. So I'm just a listeninger of prog and classics > 1900.

[yorksrvc]

Well..started playing guitar in 1966, sold all my equipment in 1978. What a shame:(( My first band was called Southside 6: British and Ameican Blues 67-68. I played guitar in 2 or 3 3 pc. bands in 69-71, played bass in a 9 pc. disco band 74-76 and ended my playing as a full time musician (bass) in a cover prog/rock and some original stuff band from 76-78. Do I consider myself a "musician"? Though I could play fairly well, at the time, the fact that I quit, makes me more of a "wanted to be". All I can do now is riff around the neck. I never was good at remembering songs, once they dropped my playlist, I forgot 'em.
What do I like musically? Actually.........about anything, but rap. I was heavy into "hard rock" in the late 60's early 70's. Was VERY much into import progressive and jazz/rock fusion until about 85, then the music disappeared. From 95-2000 I was HEAVY into Country. Then got hung up on 60's-70's Oldies...........00-04, where I rediscovered rock in Dream Theater, Threshold, Symphony X and then along came the moon, Aural Moon was my revival into feeling the music again, just like the good ol' days!!

[sharcnorris]

piano and Korg, lifetime habit, prog usually a keyboard medium8-q

[mossy]

Welcome to the forums, Andy!

I've never met a more musically sensitive bunch than the moonies. Whether they actually play an instrument or not, the ears of those who frequent this site are as finely tuned as those of any instrumentally oriented musician. The appreciation for music and the sensitivity to the aural muse has always been something I respect here and am constantly surprised at. So..whilst I'm not answering your Q in the way you intended, it's never seemed so black and white to me.

What makes a musician? To me, everyone on this site who participates and shares their musicality is a musician. Some have dedicated their musicality to learning an instrument, some not. Imho, both are musicians in their own way.

Thanks for the Q...a good one and as I said, I know I'm not answering it in the way you intended, but thanks for humouring me.


mossy :grinz:

[Michael]

Well I guess im a non-musician as well.But i did Play guitar and Keyboards for sometime(1985 to 1995ish)Sold em all and got married.I never thought i was any good but i did learn how to read sheet music so It was not all a wast :).Music well i really use to HATE Metal Bands(When i was in School i hated Maiden and all there ilk)Now I seem to take a total turn around and like em Hell Im a Big Anthrax Fan i think there a great bunch of guys doing what they love when they could of been like every other band in the world and do what MR. Fat Cat record Lable man tells em.They din't and right there is why i like most of the bands i like they pretty much told the big guy Eat S&^t were going to do it our way.But my real love is the late 60 and 70's Bands let it be know i was just born in 1969 but i grew up hearing alot of Music from that time and i always go back to it(Floyd,Genesis,Rush,Stones,Yes,The Who,Zepplin,James Gang,Bowi,Sweet ect ect ect)I think i can say im not a big fan of RAP and i never will IMHO they are nothing but NO Talent Losers that rip off other people's songs to trash em for there own gain.But other than Rap I'll give anything a chance which is why i come to the Moon anyway to hear stuff i never heard and not hear the stuff some dumb ass in a suit worth more than a months pay for me says is cool.8-) Rock ON

[Andyyyy]

Welcome to the forums, Andy!

I've never met a more musically sensitive bunch than the moonies. Whether they actually play an instrument or not, the ears of those who frequent this site are as finely tuned as those of any instrumentally oriented musician. The appreciation for music and the sensitivity to the aural muse has always been something I respect here and am constantly surprised at. So..whilst I'm not answering your Q in the way you intended, it's never seemed so black and white to me.

What makes a musician? To me, everyone on this site who participates and shares their musicality is a musician. Some have dedicated their musicality to learning an instrument, some not. Imho, both are musicians in their own way.

Thanks for the Q...a good one and as I said, I know I'm not answering it in the way you intended, but thanks for humouring me.


mossy :grinz:

Thanks Mossy!

I think we can see that prog fans actually have more than a casual interest in music...

[KeithieW]

Welcome Andyyyy. It's good that you joined the Forum and, more importantly, the family that is The Moon.

I own a few guitars incl. a Fender Strat that I love but can't really play a note. I have sung in a few bands but never anything seriously. Just for (huge amounts of) FUN.

I have a very eclectic taste in music but my main focus (no pun intended :) ) is Prog, Classical (11th C onwards) and Jazz esp. Miles Davis. I love going to gigs and do so as often as possible (the first gig I can remember going to was The Doors and Jefferson Airplane in the late 60s). I feel very lucky that my Dad encouraged me to listen to all sorts of music when I was growing up and feel that this is probably the most important thing he ever did.

We did have a thread going where people listed their "Guilty Pleasures" (Mine included Barry Manilow :hrm: ) but it seems to have disappeared which is a shame because it made for fun reading. I'll look for it again and post a link if I find it.

In the mean time, welcome again Andyyyy. Why not add yourself to the Aural Moon map and stick a photo in the rogues gallery. It's always good to put a face to the name. Have fun on the Moon and don't be a stranger. Those are the only :rulez:

The map can be found here. http://www.frappr.com/auralmoon

[Darksider415]

I play the Bb soprano clarinet and the BBBb Contrabass clarinet, both for the high school band, and some solo stuff that I write in my spare time. Now, to work on that sorta-kinda transposition by ear of "The Canterbury Sequence" on the contra....

[yorksrvc]

after reading this forum, I want to say that mossy really pegged it. Appreciation of music is really in the heart and soul. Physically, I was able to express it through my hands, mind, and emotions........BUT!!! I don't play anymore and I can get REALLY emotionally over-whelmed by a sreaming high guitar note or a mellotron waving behind a driving bass or deep bass pedals or a fancy drum fill. I can be alone listening and let out a................WHEW!!! That WAS GREAT!!! or drive down the road and laugh happily at some awesome riff. You surely don't need to play or be playing to feel the beat!!! I:heart: MUSIC!!!

[Yesspaz]

Hello Andyyyy. I think there're are a lot of "musicians" in this world that are musicians only because a certain artist or composition inspired them to pick up an instrument. I'm in this group. I play bass because I always wanted to be in a rock band, and my musician heroes are Chris Squire, John Entwistle, Paul McCartney, Ross Valory, and many others. But ultimately I'd have to say I'm not really a musician because of my total lack of skill. Rather, I don't have the skill to play the type of music I want to play (I'm more than adequate to play 90% of the stuff you hear on your local classic rock station).

[mossy]

Further to my earlier post, the definition of "musician" is still unclear to me.

I sung in choirs growing up, toured with a national equivalent of "Godspell", played tambourine in a folk-rock band, "played" flute at parties and jams, and lived in the woods off lyric royalties for two years. This isn't a sorry list of "accomplishments" but rather fodder to ask...Does this make me a musician? I've never thought so in the global scheme of things, but I've never felt like less of a musician than the next Joe Blow.

Seriously...I have no idea. I wouldn't call people like Rick/Roll or Mortis non-musicians though, because they don't actually play an instrument.

Perhaps this thread should be redefined as who plays an instrument and who doesn't.

:horsepoop

[Rick and Roll]

toured with a national equivalent of "Godspell",

Perhaps this thread should be redefined as who plays an instrument and who doesn't.

:horsepoop

I can see that :yougo

Good point!

[Andyyyy]

Further to my earlier post, the definition of "musician" is still unclear to me.

I sung in choirs growing up, toured with a national equivalent of "Godspell", played tambourine in a folk-rock band, "played" flute at parties and jams, and lived in the woods off lyric royalties for two years. This isn't a sorry list of "accomplishments" but rather fodder to ask...Does this make me a musician? I've never thought so in the global scheme of things, but I've never felt like less of a musician than the next Joe Blow.

Seriously...I have no idea. I wouldn't call people like Rick/Roll or Mortis non-musicians though, because they don't actually play an instrument.

Perhaps this thread should be redefined as who plays an instrument and who doesn't.

:horsepoop

Hmmm... This shows that perhaps "musician" can be an incremental thing. It's not like pregnancy in that either one is or one isn't. You have shown that different people can posses varying degrees of musicianship. What's sad to see is that there are many of us who had the spark for music, but life has taken that spark out. Raising kids and having a family is draining, so who can have the energy required to learn and play music AND keep your day job? There are those who have become successful at living off music (and we all need to live off our talents and capabilities somehow), but there are many more like myself, who were not good enough to earn a living from music, but as we got older and have just a bit more time, can now return to music. The downside- we're not as good as we would have been had we stuck with it for 30 years.

after reading this forum, I want to say that mossy really pegged it. Appreciation of music is really in the heart and soul. Physically, I was able to express it through my hands, mind, and emotions........BUT!!! I don't play anymore and I can get REALLY emotionally over-whelmed by a sreaming high guitar note or a mellotron waving behind a driving bass or deep bass pedals or a fancy drum fill. I can be alone listening and let out a................WHEW!!! That WAS GREAT!!! or drive down the road and laugh happily at some awesome riff. You surely don't need to play or be playing to feel the beat!!! I:heart: MUSIC!!!

Amen to that! Sounds like the definition of GEnesis, or even more, Steve HAckett!

[ricb]

musician - the IAN suffix at the end of a word usually means in the context of ones profession, ie source of earning a living. i have always understood the word to mean just that, just as in the following professions; physician, magician, mathematician etc etc.

as the dictionary states:


musician

noun
1: someone who plays a musical instrument (as a profession) [syn: instrumentalist, player]
2: artist who composes or conducts music as a profession

i used to be a musician in the dictionary sense of the word, as i composed/played music for my living.

i am currently not a musician, but rather a competent player; a musical instrument player and vocalist.

[Andyyyy]

Hello Andyyyy. I think there're are a lot of "musicians" in this world that are musicians only because a certain artist or composition inspired them to pick up an instrument. I'm in this group. I play bass because I always wanted to be in a rock band, and my musician heroes are Chris Squire, John Entwistle, Paul McCartney, Ross Valory, and many others. But ultimately I'd have to say I'm not really a musician because of my total lack of skill. Rather, I don't have the skill to play the type of music I want to play (I'm more than adequate to play 90% of the stuff you hear on your local classic rock station).

Hey Yesspaz!
Yeah, I picked up the bass because it had 4 strings and I thought it would be easier to learn! :mad: Poor reason! Squire was one of my favs too! (Who ever heard of putting tremelo on a bass till Squire did it on Starship Trooper!) Love Jeff Berlin, Tony Levin, Baba Elefante and others. Also managed to learn a little keyboards, though I haven't gotten that good on either. I love writing and that's where the keys come in. I too wanted to be in a band, especially after all the bands my younger brother was in that I got to watch. My one and only band was in the early 80s when I rented a room from a drummer. He was the one who exposed me to prog. I ws into jazz/rock, he turned me on to Genesis, Gentle Giant, Mahavishnu, et al. Also helped me develop a feel for odd rhythms since 4/4 bored him! I was infected for life! We had a total of two gigs, and we had em dancin in 11/8! But with today's equipment, you can be in a virtual band. That's how we did much of the music on Giant for an Hour (in the Musical Suggestions forum). Maybe we can light some fires here too!

[Andyyyy]

Welcome Andyyyy. It's good that you joined the Forum and, more importantly, the family that is The Moon.

I own a few guitars incl. a Fender Strat that I love but can't really play a note. I have sung in a few bands but never anything seriously. Just for (huge amounts of) FUN.

I have a very eclectic taste in music but my main focus (no pun intended :) ) is Prog, Classical (11th C onwards) and Jazz esp. Miles Davis. I love going to gigs and do so as often as possible (the first gig I can remember going to was The Doors and Jefferson Airplane in the late 60s). I feel very lucky that my Dad encouraged me to listen to all sorts of music when I was growing up and feel that this is probably the most important thing he ever did.

We did have a thread going where people listed their "Guilty Pleasures" (Mine included Barry Manilow :hrm: ) but it seems to have disappeared which is a shame because it made for fun reading. I'll look for it again and post a link if I find it.

In the mean time, welcome again Andyyyy. Why not add yourself to the Aural Moon map and stick a photo in the rogues gallery. It's always good to put a face to the name. Have fun on the Moon and don't be a stranger. Those are the only :rulez:

The map can be found here. http://www.frappr.com/auralmoon

Thanks Keithie! I done it! I like this, it's kinda cool to see who all is here!

My first bass was Rick 4001 (or was it 4002?) The neck warped and was not fixable. So I got a Kraemer with an aluminum neck. It's straight as an arrow today!

[Andyyyy]

musician - the IAN suffix at the end of a word usually means in the context of ones profession, ie source of earning a living. i have always understood the word to mean just that, just as in the following professions; physician, magician, mathematician etc etc.

as the dictionary states:


musician

noun
1: someone who plays a musical instrument (as a profession) [syn: instrumentalist, player]
2: artist who composes or conducts music as a profession

i used to be a musician in the dictionary sense of the word, as i composed/played music for my living.

i am currently not a musician, but rather a competent player; a musical instrument player and vocalist.

So do thrown rotten tomatoes count as payment? :-o~

Interesting, but I suppose we can say musicist instead? (for the hobbyists like me?)

[ricb]

So do thrown rotten tomatoes count as payment?

if they are used as sustenance after the initial splat...i believe so. lol

[Andyyyy]

I play the Bb soprano clarinet and the BBBb Contrabass clarinet, both for the high school band, and some solo stuff that I write in my spare time. Now, to work on that sorta-kinda transposition by ear of "The Canterbury Sequence" on the contra....

Hey DS,
I'd like to hear that when ready! Sounds like it could be Gentle Giantish!

[ricb]

than play it backwards...it might sound Giant Gentleish...

[mossy]

i am currently not a musician, but rather a competent player; a musical instrument player and vocalist.

Thank you for the definition ric, I would never have thought it, and also being specific about your personal attributes. Please add "humblist" to your list. I've heard your stuff.

Andy, musicist is great! Add that to your profile on the moon :thumbsup:

[Andyyyy]

LOL! OK Mossy, added "musicist" to my profile, thanks for the suggestion!

[kirk]

i dunno mossy...that's like saying a english literature teacher
is a novelist, isn't it?
there's a lot more to being a musician than the understanding of music.
that would be a "musicologist".

personally, i consider myself to be a producer, and sometime composer
rather than a "musician". i have no desire to be an entertainer
or performer at this point.

andyyy- feel free to hit the AM/Zenpool request button.:rolleyes:

kirk

[roger]

shit damn, kirk. cool.

[Andyyyy]

OK, I think I'll change my description to green with envy! Nice setup Kirk! I'll check out yer samples on CD Baby tonight, when I get off work...

That bottom keyboard on the second rack sure looks like a thinner version of the Fantom X8, or is it the Fantom with the foto playing tricks on my eyes...

[kirk]

thanks roger and andy!

good eye andy, it's a fantom x6.
there's also a proteus 2000 module under the monitor on R.

actually, the studio's changed a bit since this pic.
i now have a much larger mackie mixer, mackie HR824 monitors.
the yorkville YSM1a's are now to the rear channels for 5.1
surround mixing in sonar 5 producer.

i added a chapman stick to the collection of guitars (off photo),
several softsynths incl. the arturia moogs, Z3ta, absynth3,
steinberg's hypersonic, linnplug albino...
i'm looking to replace the M L yamaha w/a controller keyboard
dedicated to them.

kirk

[Andyyyy]

thanks roger and andy!

good eye andy, it's a fantom x6.
there's also a proteus 2000 module under the monitor on R.

actually, the studio's changed a bit since this pic.
i now have a much larger mackie mixer, mackie HR824 monitors.
the yorkville YSM1a's are now to the rear channels for 5.1
surround mixing in sonar 5 producer.

i added a chapman stick to the collection of guitars (off photo),
several softsynths incl. the arturia moogs, Z3ta, absynth3,
steinberg's hypersonic, linnplug albino...
i'm looking to replace the M L yamaha w/a controller keyboard
dedicated to them.

kirk

What?! No Klipsch?
:D

[kirk]

funny you should mention that...klipsch towers downstairs, on
the surround front speakers, 42in. plasma w/ HD.

i have a pair of advents, which you can see in the photo
to check sound on commercial speakers.

kirk

[Andyyyy]

You da man! Yeah, I have a pair of KG4s, but they are not good for studio work. Also have the mighty Klipschhorns, and they won't fit into a studio. I need to break down and get a pair of nearfields...

BTW, if ya wanna make those towers sound REAL good, get yourself a nice tube amp ;-)

[roger]

I guess I consider myself a musician, though most of my work these days is in classical vocal work, rather than prog. I have played drums in a rock cover band, keys in a jazz/fusion group, and electric fretless bass in a jazz quintet.
I have a small studio setup with an old Tascam 388 1/4 inch 8-track.(though it's in storage right now, until I can get a house after the divorce...) but I'm not going to post any pictures of that! ;)
oh, and I listen to a lot of music. prog, jazz, classical, 70's pop like Boston and Journey, and newer pop like Sting and Dave Matthews.

[sharcnorris]

all this for CHOP STICKS!!!!!!.......................:knowing: :rawk: :knowing: :rawk: :knowing: :rawk:

[kirk]

yeah, it does seem like a bit much for playing "louie louie".:rofl:
...considering i could've bought a used ferrari for the same $$...D'OH!!

actually, if you have the time to learn this, where it
gets you is all over the world-

http://www.melo.pl/album/aid/19680


kirk

[lotus]

I declare myself as non musician, although I sung in my youth in High School and University choir (Bass, although bariton), had my lessons of classical guitar and played in High School times in blues and (presumably, because lausy) prog band..

8-)

[Andyyyy]

Wow Kirk!
That is around the world! That .pl puts the site in Poland, and the language on the site is Polish. Perhaps Wojtek and I can offer translation services? :)

[Andyyyy]

I guess I consider myself a musician, though most of my work these days is in classical vocal work, rather than prog. I have played drums in a rock cover band, keys in a jazz/fusion group, and electric fretless bass in a jazz quintet.
I have a small studio setup with an old Tascam 388 1/4 inch 8-track.(though it's in storage right now, until I can get a house after the divorce...) but I'm not going to post any pictures of that! ;)
oh, and I listen to a lot of music. prog, jazz, classical, 70's pop like Boston and Journey, and newer pop like Sting and Dave Matthews.

Hey Roger,
Yeah, been there, done that! Keep the flame for music burning for there will be a time you can get that house and set up your studio. Divorce is so freaking expensive, and the only ones who make out in it are the lawyers and ex wives...

[roger]

> and the only ones who make out in it are the lawyers and ex wives...

true, dat. :surrender

[Darksider415]

> and the only ones who make out in it are the lawyers and ex wives...

true, dat. :surrender

Makes me glad to be a single teenager, with an insane addiction to prog, clarinets and computers.

The irony of this whole thread is that it makes me realize that I'm not the only person here with an instrument that's worth more than my car.

School-owned Contrabass clarinet - $15k-20k new. Will never own, unless ancient.

The professional-line soprano clarinet I got for my b-day and christmas during my 8th grade year - $2300 after sales tax.

My 1993 Nissan Sentra - Blue Book value of $1525.

Do the math...

[kirk]

darksider- don't think that because you play the clarinet,
you're exempt from gearlust!:D
you need a wind controller!-
http://www.patchmanmusic.com/WindControllerBanks.html

these are awesome. you can plug them into a synth module or
keyboard, play any of the presets. I.E.- a full orchestral sound
from a single note, or use the natural articulation for other horn instruments.
there's usually a few at auction on ebay.
i'm a flautist, i didn't have any trouble at all adapting.

actually, i just paid off my second new beetle last month...!
more to spend on gear for awhile.
they're both turbos, but mine's a collector, a 2001 20-valve
ltd. edition (only 5000 made) turbo sport w/ only 30,000 miles.
this thing will get rubber while moving w/o downshifting.
here she is-
(mine's identical, same color as this stock photo,
except mine says "sport" on the trunk, has the popup spoiler)

kirk

[roger]

now where's that picture of my mini-van?

:rofl:

[kirk]

rog-
time to razor that soccer ball, do the "pimp my ride"!
piano keys airbrushed down the side...vanity plate...haha "RAJAH"..
amp and rockfords in the back...

seriously, i'm in a transitional phase also.
my wife and i married young, so now we're (relatively) young
empty nesters.
it's like hitting the lottery! you don't realize how much
of the resources goes to the kids until they're out of the house.
it's weird being able to go to movies, restaurants...brewpubs
at any time of the night, no need to be home at any certain time..
and to actually be able to afford it!
it took us 6 months to pry ourselves off the couch,
turn off the TV...

i'm seriously considering putting those stats and awards to work,
opening a commercial studio.

kirk

[Darksider415]

Eh, Rog, what minivan, just out of curiosity? Believe it or not, Renault did a concept van back in '97, based on the chassis of their then-current F1 car. I remember it having somewhere around 750-odd horsepower, and around a 15000 RPM redline.

That ain't no soccer van...

~ds415

[roger]

> Renault

heh. nope, it ain't that one.

2003 Dodge Grand Caravan. :D

actually, I like it a lot. it's the 5th one I've owned...

[Rick and Roll]

i'm seriously considering putting those stats and awards to work,
opening a commercial studio.

kirk

oh no Kirk's gone commercial! :-o~

By the way our company's official as of Friday.....:-V

Empty nest....since my oldest moved back it's been anything but=8^O

[davido]

Geek by day, musician by night!

However, I have made the decision that the second part of my life (having pretty well expended the first part) will be much more musical than the first part. Over the next several years I will stare into the abyss that is the professional pursuit of the muse.

Rock on bro's...

david
8-q