Show 11 - "Cross"

[Rick and Roll]

A good friend of mine sent me David Cross's "Exiles" CD. I liked it so much that I thought a theme would be in order.

"Like to hear it, hear it goes".....

1) Gong - Crosscurrents

The live version is smokin' too but I don't have it on CD. This one's off of Downwind.

2) Manfred Mann's Earth Band - Crossfade

Another instrumental to ease you into the show.

3) Jethro Tull - Cross-Eyed Mary

A song you may still hear on the radio. Don't blame me

4) Jethro Tull - Crossword

I don't know if there's ever been a band with more good unreleased songs than Tull. Here's one of them.

5) Beatles - Across The Universe

Two Beatles songs in three weeks? Might be the last time for awhile...enjoy.

6) UK - Carrying No Cross

Unlike a lot of "Supergroups", I really like UK's records.

7-9) Cross - Bleeding In Silence
The Core
Welcome To Utopia

Another Rogor Mortis submission. Three fine cuts off of "Secrets". Gotta start paying royalties soon. Let's see...anything times zero equals zero...that's a fair price! Thanks again, RM.

10) Erik Norlander - No Cross To Carry

Don't own any of his stuff. Don't really know why.....

11) Magellan - Feel The Cross

A band I don't know a lot about...sounded like a good tune.

12) Passport - Cross-Collateral

This one's a jumpy fellow!

13) Pallas - Cross and Crucible

Another band I don't own anything by.....

14) Iron Maiden - The Sign of the Cross

A stately number....great arrangement. Off of "The X Factor", with Blaze Bayley on vocals.

15) Black Sabbath - Sign of the Southern Cross

If it weren't for "Heaven and Hell" (which I consider one the finest records ever done), "The Mob Rules" would be the definitive Dio-era Sabbath record. Come to think of it "Dehumanizer" is great also.

16-23) David Cross - Exiles

Exiles
Tonk
Slippy Slide
Duo
This Is Your Life
Fast
Troppo
Hero

This is a really diverse record. The title cut is a fantastic update of the Crimson tune. Fripp and Hammill are elsewhere on the record. If you haven't heard this, I think you're in for a treat.

Hope you can tune in!

[RogorMortis]

Mouthwatering list - I'm dribbling all over the keyboard.

My main burner has conked Rick - but I have a playlist that will Roll out the Rick when you get it.........soon

[kevishev]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
15) Black Sabbath - Sign of the Southern Cross

If it weren't for "Heaven and Hell" (which I consider one the finest records ever done), "The Mob Rules" would be the definitive Dio-era Sabbath record. Come to think of it "Dehumanizer" is great also.

Dude, Dio-era Sabbath is just that. It's Dio. It ain't Sabbath! Too much emphasis on his vocals. Just like everything else he ever did. I bought "Heaven and Hell" on vinyl when it first came out. I wasn't impressed. Actually, kinda dissapointed as I recall. Although technically I suppose you can say it's a fine record, I don't know that I'd echo your sentiments as far as true
"Sabbath" goes. No freakin' way!

Heck, you probably liked Journey after that Perry guy started singing for them! lol!

Kev

[Rick and Roll]

Originally posted by kevishev
Dude, Dio-era Sabbath is just that. It's Dio. It ain't Sabbath! Too much emphasis on his vocals. Just like everything else he ever did. I bought "Heaven and Hell" on vinyl when it first came out. I wasn't impressed. Actually, kinda dissapointed as I recall. Although technically I suppose you can say it's a fine record, I don't know that I'd echo your sentiments as far as true
"Sabbath" goes. No freakin' way!

Heck, you probably liked Journey after that Perry guy started singing for them! lol!

Kev

ooh such bile and venom!

Anyway, Ian Gillian is not Sabbath!

At least he can sing. You don't like Rainbow?

Tony and Geezer did some great work after Ozzy left. That's the basis of Sabbath there, not who sings.

Some bands sound the same after the singer changes. Comparing Sabbath after the change and Journey after the change is not comparable. Journey went into a whole different area.

It's the same tired Fish/Hogarth and Gabriel/Collins argument. If a band changes, most of the time it's not the singer's fault. That's overrated. I always look at "Calling All Stations" as an example.

[kevishev]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
ooh such bile and venom!

Nah. It's all toung-in-cheek dude.

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
Anyway, Ian Gillian is not Sabbath!

Huh? You lost me on that one Rick.

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
At least he can sing. You don't like Rainbow?

At least they didn't call themselves "Deep Purple".

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
Tony and Geezer did some great work after Ozzy left. That's the basis of Sabbath there, not who sings.

I agree. But the basis of Dio IS the singing. That's why it shouldn't be called "Sabbath" at all. They should have called themselves "The Tony Geezer Dio Band" or something like that.

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
Some bands sound the same after the singer changes. Comparing Sabbath after the change and Journey after the change is not comparable. Journey went into a whole different area.

I wasn't comparring anything. Just making a point. The bands, although the names were the same, were markedly different. When I think of "Black Sabbath", I don't think of songs with Dio vocals. Just like when I think of "Journey" songs, I think of songs with Greg Rolie vocals. That's all. Although when I think of "Dio", I think of Heaven and Hell songs....does that make any sense?

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
It's the same tired Fish/Hogarth and Gabriel/Collins argument. If a band changes, most of the time it's not the singer's fault. That's overrated. I always look at "Calling All Stations" as an example.

I don't blame Dio. I've just never cared much for him. (can you tell?) And you're right about the Gabriel/Collins thing there. No contest in my opinion. Why did Collins keep the name "Genesis"? He shouldn't have.

Kev

[Yesspaz]

Steve Perry didn't ruin Journey (at first). Jonathan Cain did. The first two Cain era albums were solid albums, but it went down from there. The Cain era started the power-ballad thing that Journey is now known for. Perry didn't really screw Journey up until he convinced teh band to try "rock with soul" Raised on Radio stuff. Blech! It was stated above that it's not about the singer, but the band. I read someone once divide Genesis not into Gabriel/Collins but Hackett/No-Hackett. That makes much more sense and is the same argument for Journey's keymen.

Now back to your regularly scheduled Sabbath debate .

[Rick and Roll]

not when you're football team loses by a point.

Anyway, nice points Spaz, especially about Cain. And I know it's tongue-in-cheek Kev (that's why the icon was there).

By the way, I like the Collins-era Genesis, through the self-titled record. Same as Spaz likes the Rabin-Yes... certainly doesn't mean that the older stuff is cheapened. I'd take Selling England over Duke anyday...but I like them both.

Why should Sabbath have changed their mane? There's tons of examples of bands that changed singers but kept the name. Sometimes when it's changed it's weird. Calling that record "ABWH" is just stupid to me (I know why they had to though). I mean the only name change that makes sense is "Emerson Lake and Powell", and that's still ELP

The Ian Gillian point...he was on "Born Again", right after Mob Rules. To me the whole vibe of that is not Sabbath. Just like the Coverdale Purple stuff. Some of it's good, but it's not classic Purple. But what do I care if it's called Deep Purple or not? I saw Morse w/ Purple and still enjoyed it.

Rainbow after Dio left still called themselves "Rainbow". In fact, the first record was technically "Ritchie Blackmore's Rainbow".

Enough rambling for now

[podakayne]

i'll like the show 'cuz Carry No Cross is my favorite from that lp and i really like UK.

that's all

[Rick and Roll]

Originally posted by podakayne
i'll like the show 'cuz Carry No Cross is my favorite from that lp and i really like UK.

that's all

Actually I like the other songs better......lol!

[kevishev]

I know it all comes down to a matter of personal likes and dislikes.

I didn't like any of the Perry era Journey stuff. Even from the beginning. The power ballad stuff, by that time, wasn't even on my radar. There are some people that only know the power ballad era Journey stuff. Luckily, I knew them when they were good.

I know all about the fact that band members change and the band name stays the same. Sometimes it sucks. But what can you do?

Another classic example would be "Fleetwood Mac". Did you know that Fleetwood Mac was an underground cult type hard rock band (example album: "Then Play On") before the girls and a new guitar player joined and made them a commercial success? You may have heard the song "Oh Well". Do you know who Peter Green is? (hint: He wrote the song "Black Magic Woman") Damn...those were the days.

If you ask the average person about Fleetwood Mac, I'd bet they wouldn't know those songs or the composers. They'd think about Christine MacVee (Mac's wife), Lindsay Buckingham and that phony blond that can't sing. Too bad.

I also like the Pat Moraz and (some) Trevor Rabin Yes efforts. So go figure.

Kev

[Rick and Roll]

Originally posted by kevishev
I know it all comes down to a matter of personal likes and dislikes.

I didn't like any of the Perry era Journey stuff. Even from the beginning. The power ballad stuff, by that time, wasn't even on my radar. There are some people that only know the power ballad era Journey stuff. Luckily, I knew them when they were good.

I know all about the fact that band members change and the band name stays the same. Sometimes it sucks. But what can you do?

Another classic example would be "Fleetwood Mac". Did you know that Fleetwood Mac was an underground cult type hard rock band (example album: "Then Play On") before the girls and a new guitar player joined and made them a commercial success? You may have heard the song "Oh Well". Do you know who Peter Green is? (hint: He wrote the song "Black Magic Woman") Damn...those were the days.

If you ask the average person about Fleetwood Mac, I'd bet they wouldn't know those songs or the composers. They'd think about Christine MacVee (Mac's wife), Lindsay Buckingham and that phony blond that can't sing. Too bad.

I also like the Pat Moraz and (some) Trevor Rabin Yes efforts. So go figure.

Kev

Christine McVie was married to John McVie (bass). Mick Fleetwood was doing what's her name before Lindsey. By the way, for a pop tune, I really like "Sentimental Lady"....(Bob Welch).

Joe Jackson covered Oh Well....kind of neat.

Yeah Kev, that's what I thought you were alluding to in your initial post...it is sad when things change. I guess my son will be pissed off when Incubus changes personnel in 2011....lol!

[Yesspaz]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
the only name change that makes sense is "Emerson Lake and Powell", and that's still ELP

The only name change that makes sense to me is when a band NEVER changed members before, or had that certain line-up for so long.... For instance, if the forever-rumored three remaining Zep member album ever happens, it CANNOT be called Led Zeppelin. No Bonzo=No Zeppelin. They could be Psuedo-Zep, or Zeppelin (without Led), or simply Jones, Page, and Plant. But not LZ. Same with Rush. If for some reason one of the of the three were gone, They gotta change the name. As long as Floyd is some arrangement of Gilmour, Waters, Mason, and Wright, then fine, but if Wright quits and Eddie Jobson takes over, it's not Pink Floyd.

Yes changed members all the time, and thus continued to change sounds. ABWH should've been Yes. Same with Journey, same with King Crimson, and same with Genesis.

That's why it aggravates me that Axl Rose is touring with session guys and calling it Guns N Roses. No Slash, Izzy, Adler, or Duff = No GNR.


I think I've expressed how I feel.

[teermin8r]

Good show rick, listened a lot from the next room. Impressed with the David Cross cd.

[mossy]

Then Play On....the second album I ever bought, around 12. Great cover.

Mick Fleetwood was involved with Stevie around the time of Rumours, not before Lindsey.

Sentimental Lady by Bob Welch I also like.

The whole Mac album "Mystery to Me" has Bob Welch all over it. Good in the same way as Sentimental Lady.

[roger]

wow. I haven't heard Sentimental Lady for years...

when I was in high school, I ran into Bob Welch on an Omaha city street, and he signed the cover of that album for me.

I'll have to dig that out, and fire up the turntable...

[kevishev]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
Joe Jackson covered Oh Well....kind of neat.

In my opinion, the best lyric ever in a rock-n-roll song....

"Can't help about the shape I'm in. I can't sing, I ain't pretty and my legs are thin. Don't ask me what I think of you. I might not give the answer that you want me to....oh well."

It has been my personal credo since the first time I heard it as a punk teenager 'lo those many years ago. And continues to be to this very day....now that I'm a punk old fart !

Merry Christmas everybody...

Kev