What do proggies think of TOOL and Mars Volta?

[dying_serin]

I was just wondering. It seems that Tool gets hushed off
by some of the metal and hard rock crowd and called
"neo-prog" or a "wanker band" or "rush"-esque. But at the
same time, ... it doesn't seem like Tool has been fully excepted
into the "prog" crowd despite touring with King Crimson.
I'm not saying they're a progressive rock band... or that
they should deserve to be seen as "hardcore" in the hard rock
crowd. But... I just want to know what proggers think of TOOL
basically. I personally think they're creative and that
Maynard is a pretty smart guy. Sure, they do not write
any huge amazing epics like Yes and King Crimson do.
But I think they're respectable...

Well anyway.... thoughts.... something a proggie may enjoy?
Or just some mediocre hard rock?

And... what do you think of Mars Volta?
They try... I hear they like to extend songs and jam away
at their concerts. They seem to be a little hectic and a bit experimental at times with their music. But again... they're
also a mainstream band with another genre being a possible
foundation... emo/punk rock. ...

Well anyway, opinions of some of these new not quite prog bands? (although I'd say they're as progressive as Rush are)

[Rick and Roll]

I'm not familiar with Mars Volta but I will try.....

Our friend Zvinki from Montreal is a big Tool fan (as you will see by his avatar when he replies). I'm sure he will have some words on the subject.

I like Tool for the music - it's moving, and interesting, especially as they become more mature. Lateralus and Aenima are just awesome.

All that said, I'm not sure they're a match here. Although there is less proggier stuff on the playlist, I don't know. Not really in line with the general "theme".

these "tweener" bands are great fodder for discussion.....

[zvinki]

Thanks for the introduction Rick...

Tool is currently my favourite ear candy. Their songs are very organic (to the point of decomposing ) and textured, the musicianship is top-notch, Maynard has the best voice in rock right now, his lyrics are provocative, and the music makes you "feel". Although they have many progressive elements (they claim to be heavily influenced by King Crimson and Rush) including dizzying time changes, they don't feel right for AM. I think they are too dark and heavy for what AM has grown into.

For any adventurous souls who want to try them out, you should start with Lateralus. If you do try them, I'd love to hear what you think.

[Rick and Roll]

That is one of the most concise yet descriptive posts I've ever read.

I need to take notes.

[progdirjim(Admin)]

I'll have to check out Mars Volta - I've heard of them, but not their music.

Tool I don't like. But, I haven't heard all that much of their stuff. I'll try to check out Lateralus...

[moses]

Lateralus is, IMHO, Tool's best work thus far. It has much more depth and variety than their earlier work. But I agree, it might not fit in well on the Moon.

The Mars Volta is really wild stuff. Kinda like a constant caffeine high. And not an altogether pleasant one at that. But not bad.

[VAXman(Admin)]

Originally posted by dying_serin
I was just wondering. It seems that Tool gets hushed off
by some of the metal and hard rock crowd and called
"neo-prog" or a "wanker band" or "rush"-esque.

Tool has the aural appeal of power tools, IMHO.

I'd rather be listening to DT!...

Mastermind covered mostly Tool numbers at the last two bar gigs they did. Pure noise and eardrum agony for me but they wanted to appeal to the biker and "teen" crowd that mostly frequent this particular pub.

[Rick and Roll]

I've seen Bill Behrends' wife punch another woman at a local establishment, so I see you point, vax.

I'll bring some Tool to Rosfest.

[dying_serin]

Huh? What's with all this, "I don't think it would fit on AM"...
I never said anything about Tool or Mars Volta being on the
playlist. Infact, I agree. It wouldn't fit the radio station at all.
I just wanted to know what proggies think... and I figured
that quite a few listeners here would be proggies. Other than that.... thanks for the feedback so far.

[Rick and Roll]

I'm not really a "proggie".

I just like the station and the constituents!

[dying_serin]

Originally posted by Rick and Roll
I'm not really a "proggie".

I just like the station and the constituents!

Either way, you listen and enjoy the music on this station.
Therefore, good enough to have an opinion here.

[Wojtek]

It's not a provocation, only my personal opinion on that bands. I don''t like Tool because I find their music boring, depressing and amelodic. The Mars Volta is audible but, in my opinion, in their stuff there's too much shout, too little well-thought-out music.

[kirk]

i have tool's first 2 cds, like them.
they've spawned a bunch of imitators,
influenced others, so they must be doing something right.
at their peak, they were playing "progressively",
much like radiohead.

i won't bad mouth any fellow artists that's
even remotely capable of calling themselves
progressive rock, but mars volta.....
IMO- give them some time.

p e a c e kirk/ zenpool

[dying_serin]

Originally posted by kirk
i have tool's first 2 cds, like them.
they've spawned a bunch of imitators,
influenced others, so they must be doing something right.
at their peak, they were playing "progressively",
much like radiohead.

i won't bad mouth any fellow artists that's
even remotely capable of calling themselves
progressive rock, but mars volta.....
IMO- give them some time.

p e a c e kirk/ zenpool

The first two Tool CDs are just pretty much hard rock with a bit of a twist. The final 2 CDs are thes ones with progressive and experimental touch. You should hear them!

[kirk]

thanks, i'll check those out.

[Bob Lentil]

I love Tool's recent material; both Lateralus and Aenima are great. (Although, Aenima could have done without the little interludes with all the pointless foul language.) Their earlier stuff, however, is a bit on the boring side.

[Yesspaz]

Originally posted by zvinki
Maynard has the best voice in rock right now

He's quite good, but I think that there are others I'd put above him. I think the best (male) vocalist in rock is Pete Stewart, from a little known band called Grammatrain, and one solo album. I'd also put Michael Roe of The Seventy Sevens and Derri Daughtery of The Choir up there. Pete Loeffler of Chevelle may take the cake too.

I agree that Lateralus is where to start. I really get into Tool's music, but I can't listen to them because of Maynard's lyrics. "Hooker with a Penis" and "I love Satan"? Gimme a break. But it's interesting that musically they influenced two of my favorite bands, Stavesacre and the above mentioned Chevelle.

In fact, if you have a little bit of time, check out three of their videos, especially The Red and Point #1.

Chevelle videos

[zvinki]

I agree with the lyrics issue spaz although Lateralus is a lot more positive than the previous releases, as a matter of fact it has a very positive message thoughout. Maynard's contributions to A Perfect Circle also seem a little more easily digestible. Maybe there is light ahead.

Regarding vocalists, I only recognize the guy from Chevelle and, although he is a very good vocalist I still prefer Maynard.

[dying_serin]

I love Tool's lyrics. And I think most of it is to be crude but sarcastic on purpose. Maynard is intelligent, but angry and cynical. And I love it. He's the only person that curses intelligently. Well, atleast that's my opinion. His tone is pretty obvious! But yes... Maynard is much more angsty on his
first two albums. The first one, Opiate? Songs like "Jerk Off" and "Hush"... pretty violent. But they're funny!
I guess I can see why it may turn some people off, though

Oh, and "Hooker with a Penis" is a decepticon to title the song.
The song is about a kid who points at Tool and tells them they're selling out (whether it be a true story or not). And well...
Maynard writes lyrics in the song insulting his intelligence and
judgement and almost in a way calls him a hypocrite. And like
a Hooker with a Penis... it's not what it seems, that's the message.. Seems fine...
until you UNDRESS it.

[Rick and Roll]

Undertow is actually easier on the ears then Aenima is. I just like Aenima's arrangements a bit better. I usually dismiss lyrics that are crude, they just roll off my back. I can see why some people get offended, though. Sometimes a point can be conveyed without the histronics.

"Would you like to see the Pope at the end of a rope do you think he's a fool" on it's own is offensive, but when you realize Ozzy is actually singing it in a pro-God tune (After Forever) it kind of fits (and musically the meter he uses works). He's actually ribbing the non-religious.

I haven't met anyone yet who had heard Lateralus and NOT liked it. I would be interested in hearing from that person..........