Marillion

[Rick and Roll]

I'm glad you posted that vax, it gives good perspective on why you feel the way you do about Marillion - and hopefully Coyote and others can join you in seeing them in the future.

I am not a Hogath hater. However, I don't like much after Seasons End. It's not the vocals..it's the music. Emotion only goes so far...you need vibrancy in the music. I don't feel it. The first time I noticed this was seeing "Univited Guest" performed live, then hearing it on the record. What a difference! So flaccid on CD, but excellent live.

There's only a handful of songs after that that come to mind as vibrant. "Dry Land" is a beautiful song. Reminds me of a Marty Balin song, almost commercial. Rothery's stunning guitar makes it for me. But these moments are too few. It's the band that disappoints me. I honestly think they've gotten lazy.

Brave sealed it - I just can't get into it. It's not a metal thing. Sure I like heavy, but I also listen to stuff that makes Brave sound like Anthrax. Nothing to do with heavy. Funny, the LACK of musical emotion is my beef.

All that said, I'd like to sample Marbles. I'll always give things a shot. But this Fish vs. SH thing is silly. it's just the natural evolution of bands. I don't care if Englebert Humperdick (sp error intentional) sung on Misplaced, Clutching, or Fugazi), it would still rock my world. The music on Fugazi still tingles the spine.

Look at any other band, no matter the personnel changes, they just wear out. I'm not a prog purist or snob (except for Queen and Paul Rodgers lol), so let SH be....

And I still feel that Phil Collins is not the anti-christ (I like the Yoko Ono reference vax, very apt). look at Calling All Stations. Ray Wilson on vocals, but the album is crappy because of Banks and Rutherford. It's embarassingly pedestrian. the music of the song "Abacab" is simplistic...that's not Phil's fault. After all didn't Mike have the Mechanics? Yuck!

There are some high points in later Genesis, but much less frequent. That's just the way it is.

So that's why I'm not interested in Marillion anymore.

[VAXman(Admin)]

Originally Posted by Rick and Roll

I am not a Hogath hater. However, I don't like much after Seasons End. It's not the vocals..it's the music. Emotion only goes so far...you need vibrancy in the music.

Emotion!? There's more emotion in Brave and Afraid of Sunlight than enything Fish ever did with them.

[mailotron]

don't want to polemize ( ?) cos' I'm not good enough in english to do so but there is a lot of emotion in songs like Chelsea monday, white russian or warm wet circles to name but a few. Just for the record, I like Marillion-H a lot and never tried to compare two so different characters . To see/hear them live is always a pleasure.

[Rick and Roll]

Thanks Mail, I'm trying not to make this a Steve vs Derek thing. Really doesn't interest me.

[PFD]

Yeah, I always stay away from H vs Fish. To me they're different bands now. I think they've both put out great stuff, and some weaker stuff.

Marillion had two albums out i didn't care for. Radiation and dotcom. Anaraknophobia was a step in the right direction and Marbles is a classic. Fish peaked with Sunsets on Empire; Zippos was great IF you liked Plague of Ghosts; but his last two, I've been indifferent to.

I've seen both live countless times. Like VAX, I've also spoken to them on many occasions. I prefer Fish, overall, I think he's far more laid back than H after a gig. After gigs it's easier to chat with Fish as H is normally hounded by all the ladies!

I'll probably see VAX in Holland next February.

[VAXman(Admin)]

Originally Posted by PFD

Yeah, I always stay away from H vs Fish. To me they're different bands now. I think they've both put out great stuff, and some weaker stuff.

Marillion had two albums out i didn't care for. Radiation and dotcom.

Again, experiment. If you want to hear them regurgitate the same old same old, cut a tape loop of Grendel... play it until you're nauseous with Rick. There are some good elements but overall they're is not consistent.

Originally Posted by PFD

Anaraknophobia was a step in the right direction and Marbles is a classic. Fish peaked with Sunsets on Empire; Zippos was great IF you liked Plague of Ghosts; but his last two, I've been indifferent to.

Vigil was tiring. Sunsets is a pretty good album save for the "rap". I really can't believe he stooped to that level.

Originally Posted by PFD

I've seen both live countless times. Like VAX, I've also spoken to them on many occasions. I prefer Fish, overall, I think he's far more laid back than H after a gig. After gigs it's easier to chat with Fish as H is normally hounded by all the ladies!

You're just jealous!

Originally Posted by PFD

I'll probably see VAX in Holland next February.

See you there!

[PFD]

Originally Posted by VAXman

Again, experiment. If you want to hear them regurgitate the same old same old, cut a tape loop of Grendel... play it until you're nauseous with Rick. There are some good elements but overall they're is not consistent.

But I don't want to hear the same old, and will die happily if I never hear Grendel again. To me those two albums (dotcom, radiation) just seemed like a week attempt to get radio airplay and cash in on the Brit pop popular at the time. There's some good tunes on them, and I could make one good CD of a dozen songs from both those records.

Like I said, otherwise I enjoyed everything they did post Fish...except for Holidays In Eden which was a real bore. I didn't actually like Brave originally, until I saw them do parts of it live on the Sunlight tour. Now I love it. And I think Marbles is one of the greatest albums they've done ever.

[Rick and Roll]

Originally Posted by VAXman

Vigil was tiring. Sunsets is a pretty good album save for the "rap". I really can't believe he stooped to that level.

Sunsets is excellent. Most of his solo stuff is spotty, but I like that one a lot.

I have a friend who went to a Tears for Fears show with me in 1986 I believe. During "Seeds of Love" they broke into a 20 second rap. It ruined the otherwise GREAT show for him. I was incredulous with his intolerance. I don't like rap at all, but really it was a small thing.

Reason I bring that up is the "rap" on Sunsets is innocuous (assuming it's the Brother 52 song). Hope it is....I'm playing that in a month or so on the show. Stooping low? It's just a bit part.

[VAXman(Admin)]

Originally Posted by nadina

I've been a fan of Marillion since 1981/82. I heard Kayleigh and Lavender on the radio, but quickly realized these were not their best songs. After hearing the rest of Misplaced Childhood, I had to find the other albums. I love F-era and much of H-era. Yes, it took me a bit to get used to H, but I do like his voice. I don't love every ablum he's done, but as much as I consider myself a Fish fan, I don't love every one of his solo albums. Brave is one of my favorite albums overall (and that is including my non-Marillion albums).

Before finding the Moon, I didn't know any other Marillion fans. I was excited to see Marillion and Fish here as well as learn there were not just folks who had heard of them, but were truly fans. My love of Marillion (both versions) has been renewed since hanging around here And it was because I mentioned Marillion on my myspace page that I have a wonderful new person in my life.

Nadina

...and got to a private party with the band!

[Rick and Roll]

Originally Posted by nadina

I've been a fan of Marillion since 1981/82. I heard Kayleigh and Lavender on the radio, but quickly realized these were not their best songs. After hearing the rest of Misplaced Childhood, I had to find the other albums. I love F-era and much of H-era. Yes, it took me a bit to get used to H, but I do like his voice. I don't love every ablum he's done, but as much as I consider myself a Fish fan, I don't love every one of his solo albums. Brave is one of my favorite albums overall (and that is including my non-Marillion albums).

Before finding the Moon, I didn't know any other Marillion fans. I was excited to see Marillion and Fish here as well as learn there were not just folks who had heard of them, but were truly fans. My love of Marillion (both versions) has been renewed since hanging around here And it was because I mentioned Marillion on my myspace page that I have a wonderful new person in my life.

Nadina

When I got my prog awakening in college, Marillion hit right at the beginning (1981-84). The crap they received for Grendel was initially hard to overcome. The Apocalypse in 9/8 ripoff section was a bit much, and that gave the critics fodder for piling it on. But after Fugazi, thay distanced themselves enough from Genesis, and even spawned bands like Iluvatar, who are unabashed in their praise of the band (seeing them do the entire first side of Misplaced Live was a treat).

They've always had lots of fans, it's good that you have a place to pull them together here. And it's great about the new person

[CozyToo]

Debating taste is kinda pointless but we sooo like to do it don't we?

Originally Posted by Rick and Roll

It's not the vocals..it's the music.

Sums it up for me. Hogarth vocals > Fish vocals tbh but latter has a) Scottish accent and b) is more down to Earth precisely because of all the notes he manages to miss.

Although I agree with "LOSE THE THESAURUS" to an extend, it's still rock and Fish lyrics captured its spirit better imho.

At the end of a day both is good music to listen to and since it covers wider range of listener's mood we're better off this way.

So what's next, Barrett/Waters/Gilmour Floyds or have you guys covered that already?

[Rick and Roll]

Originally Posted by CozyToo

Debating taste is kinda pointless but we sooo like to do it don't we?

So what's next, Barrett/Waters/Gilmour Floyds or have you guys covered that already?

Believe it or not I don't care much for debate on music. Sharing opinions, yes, debate, nah.

Don't know about the Floyd. Like them fine but not going there. But it would be a ligtning rod I'm sure!