The best work of Gentle Giant.

[Andyyyy]

OK- this thread MADE me put on a couple GG CDs. First, I spun Civilian. Loved it. Rocked out totally to it. Love the playing, GG snuck in some nice syncopations here and there. But then I played 3 Friends. Compositionally, there is almost no comparison. There is soooo much more magic on 3F than on Civ.

Did you know that at the beginning of Mr Class and Quality, the first 30 seconds of that little jam is actually the same notes (played on the bass) as 3 Friends? Listen to it carefully. It's so cleverly done! And be aware that the track marker for 3 F is off (on the CD) as it actually starts in the middle of Mr Class and Quality. 3 F starts with a different melody. It lasts for only about 2-3 minutes (anyone care to guess how many times that phrase repeats?). No such problem with the vinyl version. There are many other ways in which the compositions on 3F are richer than Civ, but I'll stop here. If you don't think so, try learning the parts (guitar, bass, keys, whatever) to Civ, then try 3F. If you don't play an instrument, focus on one and try humming with that part.

There is another difference, and that is the stylistic difference between John (Pugwash) Weathers' drumming and Malcolm Mortimer's. I love them both, and I think 3 F sounds different in part because of Malc. That guitar-drums jam they did in Peel the Paint was a magic moment. His drum beat to 3 Friends is masterfull. I think Pug's style went well with the rest of their albums- he kept a strong beat while the rest did their very difficult rhythmic variations. John was steady. Malc likes to improvise.

GG tried to feed their families by changing direction. Remember, punk was in, prog was on its way out. It's really too bad that they had to do that to survive financially. And even so, they ended their recording careers by trying to be what their loyal fans perceived to be, someone other than themselves. And the world lost what would have been the next GG albums.

Thanks for making me listen!

[Rick and Roll]

Very good points about three friends......Ray's bass playing is absolutely brilliant. And a great point about the drumming!

I must take issue about the feeding the family line though - Derek, with Simon Dupree (pre-Giant) really wasn't doing Giant-type stuff. And given his vocational pursuits post-Giant, I don't think he was ever comfortable blazing a trail for Prog. Giant was the perfect storm of diverse elements blending to make fantastic records. Gary can rock out (actually he can play anything), Kerry and Ray drove the sound, and Phil had his own way....sometimes it was even basic rock. I mean look at The House The Street The Room....hard rock mixed in with the Kerry pastoral sections. I Lost My Head, they could rock.

My favorite Giant tune is In A Glass House. It's got everything rolled up into one song.

[Andyyyy]

You're so right about Ray- because he doesn't play like a typical bass player, I forget to give him credit. He is as superb musician who happened to play the bass (among other instruments).

I meant to say that they felt (at that time) they needed to become more commercial to survive financially (after the fact it turned out to be the kiss of death). The Simon Dupree thing may have been an attempt at hitting the rock scene, I dunno. But the Shulmans and Kerry have classical training, which is where they got many of their musical ideas. According to the Italian interview on the DVD, they were trying to be "different". And when they did that, they were successful.