Rick explains reason for not touring with Yes

[Rick and Roll]

Originally Posted by Mike413

I don't know what their game is at this point. I did hear something about tentative plans to possibly record a new album(although ofcourse we shouldn't count our chickens). In my mind it doesn't make sense to tour after such a long gap without promoting a new album in the works. Yes might be one of those rare bands who could still get away with playing material they haven't recorded yet.

Also, I understand Rick's concern. He's had health issues in the past and in light of this he is not out of line or being unreasonable with his decision.

Is it a rule that you have to have a new record to promote to tour? I'm glad they have the flexibility to do what they want.

Whatever decision is made is none of our business, really. It is nice of RW to tell us - he is a stand-up guy - but I don't see any reason being out of line.

Sorry to sound contrary - I was disappointed but not surprised of some of the reaction to this and the proposed tour set list on that "other" site... Yes owes me nothing. With the internet, we're able to tell what will be played, and we can choose from there.

I paid 90 bucks to see them in July. I was owed 50 so that made it palatable and I know nothing will beat the last time I saw them maybe 6 yrs ago. But I'm still gladly going.

[Mike413]

[quote=Rick and Roll;33175]Is it a rule that you have to have a new record to promote to tour? I'm glad they have the flexibility to do what they want.



No absolutely not but they haven't had an album out in a while and people are beginning to call them a nostalgia act. NOt having an album out just plays into that. At least if they are promoting material it makes it appear that they aren't doing it just for the money and that they have their fans in mind(a little more than if they didn't). That's just my opinion. These days most bands don't tour without an album to promote. THat's the way it usually goes. Kansas does it and the Grateful Dead did it. So yeah, it's not a big deal but I think many Yes fans feel they owe them one more album.

[Rick and Roll]

[quote=Mike413;33177]

Originally Posted by Rick and Roll

Is it a rule that you have to have a new record to promote to tour? I'm glad they have the flexibility to do what they want.



No absolutely not but they haven't had an album out in a while and people are beginning to call them a nostalgia act. NOt having an album out just plays into that. At least if they are promoting material it makes it appear that they aren't doing it just for the money and that they have their fans in mind(a little more than if they didn't). That's just my opinion. These days most bands don't tour without an album to promote. THat's the way it usually goes. Kansas does it and the Grateful Dead did it. So yeah, it's not a big deal but I think many Yes fans feel they owe them one more album.

1. Not this person. They are a band, and anyone that calls them a nostalgia act can do so for their reasons. Whether they put out an album, it makes no difference to me.

2. I would expect money to have some play into whether a band tours or not. Live performance is one of the few ways a band can make money. In fact, making money enables a band to tour, therefore enabling you to see the product. Whether or not they "do it for the money" to me doesn't mean they don't consider the fans.

3. Bands don't tour without an album a lot now because a lot of bands constantly tour (see 2).

4. See my earlirer posts. Yes owes nothing. No one "owes" anything to us. With the internet and communication at an all-time high, the fans know what's going to happen before the artist thinks it up! (ok an exaggeration...) If I like the way the tour is shaping up, I'll go. And if I don't like the concert, I won't go again. For fans to say they owe us anything is a bit selfish.

[Mike413]

[quote=Rick and Roll;33178]

Originally Posted by Mike413

4. See my earlirer posts. Yes owes nothing. No one "owes" anything to us. With the internet and communication at an all-time high, the fans know what's going to happen before the artist thinks it up! (ok an exaggeration...) If I like the way the tour is shaping up, I'll go. And if I don't like the concert, I won't go again. For fans to say they owe us anything is a bit selfish.

Speak for yourself. No groups owe their fans anything? It's only their fans who buy their records and their tickets. I think it's selfish if bands do music only for themselves and don't take into account how they are coming across to those who feed them. In some ways you are right but either extreme is unhealthy.

True bands ultimately have the say over what they do or don't do but I can't help notice when a band is still touring that their last studio album was "somewhere to elsewhere in 2000 or "magnification" in 2001 and here it is almost the end of the decade. I think the fans have a right to hear new material at some point otherwise just buy the dvd. I'm a little bit more forgiving but I can certainly understand fans who feel that way. I'd say it's possible for both the bands and the fans to be selfish.

Ok this is it for me. If you want to continue this debate send me a pm. I don't want to waste any more space on this thread with this because it's just going around in circles.

[Rick and Roll]

[quote=Mike413;33182]

Originally Posted by Rick and Roll

Speak for yourself. No groups owe their fans anything? It's only their fans who buy their records and their tickets. I think it's selfish if bands do music only for themselves and don't take into account how they are coming across to those who feed them.

Ok this is it for me. If you want to continue this debate send me a pm. I don't want to waste any more space on this thread with this because it's just going around in circles.

Mike I am speaking for myself.....

I have a question - If it is selfish for bands not to take their fans into account, then is it a sellout if they do? You know the majortity wants to hear the hits. Damned if you do and damned if you don't. I just think we put unreasonable expectations on artists.

This is funny, actually - on PE I was disappointed with the way some of the people talk to each other when they disagree. So I said to some of them basically what you did, that I didn't want to keep going back and forth. So here, we're having an actual discussion, and the same thing happens.

That's ok Mike. I don't want to pm, I was just making some points in a forum, no problem.

[OverHillandDale(Admin)]

I have to agree with Rick (OMG - somebody write this date down.)

Bands should never 'cater' to the fans when it comes to their music and how they present it. Otherwise it would be an all hits all the time fiasco.

For musicians to streatch, grow, change and mature, they have to do what they feel is right for them. As an artist if you create something just for someone else (like an "intended" fan base - be it one person or millions) than you're not true to yourself and the creativity you possess.

It is the artist's creativity and ingeniuity that makes them so special. When they do cater, such as when record companies try to insist on creative control and demand 'x' amount of records in a specific time frame, then the music almost always suffers. You can't be forced to create. Just because someone wants a new album from an artist doesn't mean they are going to get it, nor that the artist "owes" them the product.

Touring is the most lucrative means for musical artists to share their music with the fans. Recordings are the other way. And with file sharing these days, recording is not very lucrative except on an extremely grand scale. Not something our genre's favorite artists are able to achieve, except in very special circumstances. It's sad for so many gifted musicians, but unfortunately true. Schlock sells, genius takes time.

Touring, on the other hand allows a creative commune with the fan base. Sure the songs may be from material that is not new in some cases. But it is personally packaged for each audience and delivered with as much charisma, technical skills, and creative touches as possible. Having altered or changed line-ups also changes the music and the character of what they are presenting. It's made it new again, just in that light.

So, long story short: No, bands don't owe us a thing, just as we don't owe them our hard earned money, time and adoration, should we become disillusioned about their supposed motifs for doing what they do. In other words, if you don't like the program, change the channel.

And in the case of Yes - they have almost 40 years of material to work with, as well as the wealth of solo material each of the musicians have generated. That's a pretty damn big playlist. It's not like they only have 3 or 4 discs to choose from.

[MrMagoo]

Originally Posted by OverHillandDale

I have to agree with Rick (OMG - somebody write this date down.)

April 6, 2008!